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Title: Affirmative Action
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Essyne - February 13, 2008 03:29 AM (GMT)
About 3 weeks ago, my school had a mild "shooting scare." It turned out that it was a gang fight that quickly escalated - what else is new? - but what bothered me about it was how quickly race was entered into the mix. It seems like caucasians are now the scapegoats for the African-American community. I do not understand why people who couldn't even begin to COMPREHEND slavery are still crying "affirmative action" in the streets (or halls, in this case ;) ). "Reverse racism" is a HUGE thing in America today, and frankly, I think it violates my personal freedoms as a caucasian. "MY PEOPLE" never enslaved "YOUR PEOPLE"; trust me, the Italians/Irish had problems of their own!!! Newsflash here, the Africans sold Africans!!

Why should I not be able to get a scholarship, simply because of my race? Why is it that a black woman can enter the Miss America Pageant, but a white woman can't enter the "BLACK" Miss America Pageant (yeah yeah... I know, but you get my drift)? If you are against the segregation of society then you are AGAINST the segregation of society.

I think that the government should END ALL AFFIRMATIVE action to combat this growing trend of "reverse racism." No "black" this and "black" that. Just "America".

EDIT: GENERAL POST? ( I just now realized that I put it in "POLITICS" . . . . oh well, you'll either get over it or move it :P )

Cloaked - February 13, 2008 05:36 AM (GMT)
I can easily understand both sides of affirmative action and reparations and the like, though I am unsure of my opinion on both. I think I am against them, but I haven't put too much thought into it. However, I still see the valid points in affirmative action; it's not like it's in place for no reason. Racism pervades the country today, obviously. What a lot of people fail to realize though is how much slavery still affects America today. It very much so does affect the black community, etc. Still, this does not mean that affirmative action is the way to solve the problems.

Most people think affirmative action is just minorities "getting their due." What it really is is an attempt to "even up the score" between causasians and minorities because like it or not, there is still a great amount of discrimination against minorities. While there is discrimination against caucasians as Essyne said, it does not have nearly as profound an effect because it is the caucasians who are in power, though that does not make it any less wrong.

On a bit of a side note, I hate when people argue that we need to make up for slavery when they have no idea what they are talking about. We need to make up for nothing. We did nothing wrong. What we need to do is constantly seek out a means to reach equality. THAT is the only moral obligation we have, in my opinion.

Essyne - February 14, 2008 02:08 AM (GMT)
Slavery only affects the black community because they still want it to affect them. And I'm sorry, Cloaked, but since when are the caucasians "in power"?!?! That's ridiculous in my opinion; please clarify.

Cloaked - February 14, 2008 10:13 PM (GMT)
They were in power since the last 43 presidents of the United States were white men. I could go on forever about something like this. And slavery does affect the black community. One can't just simplify it into "their daddy wasn't a slave so it can't affect them." For starters the pervasive racism in this country against blacks was charged on by slavery.

How can you claim they would WANT to be affected by slavery? I find that to be ridiculous in my opinion. One would be hard-pressed to find a person who WANTS to live the majority of their life with the only thing on his mind being survival in exchange for some attention.

Essyne - February 15, 2008 01:40 AM (GMT)
QUOTE (Cloaked @ Feb 14 2008, 10:13 PM)
How can you claim they would WANT to be affected by slavery?

That's easy - they want it to affect them because it gives them substantial benefits. Thousands of dollars more scholarship money for crappy test scores?! I'd take it!

You're making a common mistake, Cloaked. You're thinking about slavery as if it's happening right now. Blacks have been voting for YEARS now; President Bush is not in the White House because he's WHITE, he's there because he took the initiative to get there. The race card is EVERYWHERE, my friend, and it's NOT the whites throwing it around. Get over the past. Live in the future. Spend your money how you want, but I think it's wrong to endorse the thought that I owe someone something because of the color of their skin.

Cloaked - February 15, 2008 08:12 PM (GMT)
To make money you need money. Yeah, it's possible to be successful when you have nothing to use, but such is a rare case. When the slaves were freed, they had no money. They were sentenced basically to freedom with the black codes, and when those were finally abolished, there was then the entire segregation issue, which was extremely rampant in the South. So blacks still don't have even close to an equal opportunity at this time. Then, after segregation was finally outlawed throughout the nation, thus hurting racial discrimination, we still had to work to FINALLY reach a point of equality. This was barely forty years ago that segregation was outlawed. Forty years is not nearly enough time to purge centuries of racism and hatred and discrimination. And so in general, blacks are still at a severe disadvantage in society, and it stems from slavery.

And yes, using one president who is white could never be considered a rational argument that blacks are at a disadvantage. But 43 presidents is another story. If you have a classroom full of kids and one says the teacher is unfair, it is not necessarily likely that it is true. However, if every kid says so for decades...

Essyne - February 19, 2008 12:03 AM (GMT)
QUOTE (Cloaked @ Feb 15 2008, 08:12 PM)
To make money you need money. Yeah, it's possible to be successful when you have nothing to use, but such is a rare case.
[ . . . ]

Forty years is not nearly enough time to purge centuries of racism and hatred and discrimination. And so in general, blacks are still at a severe disadvantage in society, and it stems from slavery.
[ . . . ]

If you have a classroom full of kids and one says the teacher is unfair, it is not necessarily likely that it is true. However, if every kid says so for decades...

Oh really?! Because the last time that I checked, Cloaked, millions of people still make money "without money" in this country. It's not a question of how rich or how poor you are when you arrive on American shores. It's not that hard to get off your butt and get a job, even if it is minimum wage. Such is not as "rare" a case as you'd like to believe.

Second, America is not as "discriminating" against minorities as you have been led to believe. In fact, America CATERS to these minorities. It's disgusting. As for it "stemming from slavery," my ancestors DIED to free the slaves, so should I be given benefits?! Obviously, my answer is a resounding "NO." Meritocracies work, my friend, and I wish that America would soon become a true meritocracy.

As for your final quote - That argument could go both ways, so please, let's not go with the "majority rules".....

Cloaked - February 19, 2008 12:18 AM (GMT)
I'm talking about prospering with a financially successful life, not merely getting by on a two-bit income. America caters to minorities legally yes, but laws aren't worth the paper they're written on unless the people support them. Maybe you're fortunate enough to live in a racism-free environment, but racism is extremely present in our country and xenophobia runs as rampant as ever. And whether we like it or not, majority does rule most of the time.

Essyne - February 20, 2008 02:49 AM (GMT)
Define "racism" in your own words, please.

Cloaked - February 20, 2008 04:58 AM (GMT)
The belief that one race is superior to another or is more capable, or the that one race is inferior or is less capable than others.

Essyne - February 21, 2008 03:06 AM (GMT)
The reason that I started this post is because I don't live in a "racism-free environment". The only difference here is that the roles are reversed. Call it "whites getting what they deserve"/ WHATEVER, but here's my argument: I have to live through all of this crap, so why don't I get benefits?! See the issue?? Just because you're black doesn't mean you've encountered racism. Just because you're white doesn't mean you have NOT encountered racism. Past problems don't matter. It's the PRESENT that is important. Eliminate affirmative action and let's have the same rules for everyone. IF problems arise, then we'll deal with them later, but blanket laws, like blanket statements and generalizations (hmmm . . .. sound like racism, anyone?!), are not the way to go.

Cloaked - February 21, 2008 09:26 PM (GMT)
I wholeheartedly agree about the blanket laws thing. The problem is that the federal government can only make blanket laws, it cannot pick and choose for whom the laws apply, which in essence proves affirmative action unconstitutional. It would therefore have to be controlled at the state or even the municipal level, but that would simply cause that state or city to be unpopular, and the larger businesses, which are the most important, would simply shift headquarters somewhere else. Affirmative action really isn't the way to go at all, in my opinion.




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