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Title: Primeape Analysis
Description: Status: Ready for Proofing


Master12345 - July 31, 2010 02:38 AM (GMT)
Checklist:
  • Overview: Complete
  • 'Standard': Complete
  • Choice Band: Complete
  • Team Options: Complete
  • Optional Changes: Complete
  • Counters: Complete
Primeape

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user posted image[doHTML]<table id="dex_Pokemon_stats" cellpadding="4" cellspacing="0">
<caption><h4>Statistics</h4></caption>
<thead>
<tr>
<th colspan="3"></th>
<th>Min-</th>
<th>Min</th>
<th>Max</th>
<th>Max+</th>
</tr>
</thead>

<tbody>
<tr>
<th>HP</th>
<td>65</td>
<td class="bar">
<div style="width:130px; height:15px; background:#FF4C00
"></div>
</td>
<td>-</td>
<td>271</td>
<td>334</td>
<td>-</td>
</tr>

<tr>
<th>Atk</th>
<td>105</td>
<td class="bar">
<div style="width:210px; height:15px; background:#E6FF00
"></div>
</td>
<td>221</td>
<td>246</td>
<td>309</td>
<td>339</td>
</tr>

<tr>
<th>Def</th>
<td>60</td>
<td class="bar">
<div style="width:120px; height:15px; background:#FF3200
"></div>
</td>
<td>140</td>
<td>156</td>
<td>219</td>
<td>240</td>
</tr>

<tr>
<th>SpA</th>
<td>60</td>
<td class="bar">
<div style="width:120px; height:15px; background:#FF3200
"></div>
</td>
<td>140</td>
<td>156</td>
<td>219</td>
<td>240</td>
</tr>

<tr>
<th>SpD</th>
<td>70</td>
<td class="bar">
<div style="width:140px; height:15px; background:#FF6600
"></div>
</td>
<td>158</td>
<td>176</td>
<td>239</td>
<td>262</td>
</tr>

<tr>
<th>Spe</th>
<td>95</td>
<td class="bar">
<div style="width:190px; height:15px; background:#FFE400
"></div>
</td>
<td>203</td>
<td>226</td>
<td>289</td>
<td>317</td>
</tr>
</tbody>
</table>
[/doHTML]

Overview

Once hailed in NU as the "standard" revenge-killer and scout, Primeape is still a force to be reckoned with. His pure Fighting-typing provides a resistance to Stealth Rock and bestows upon Primeape an amazing STAB in Close Combat. Primeape's immunity to sleep in Vital Spirit and access to U-turn are his biggest assets over other Fighting-types, and they fit well with his role in scouting the opposing team. While he is very frail, even by NU standards, Primeape has the perfect combination in typing, ability, and movepool to remain a largely one-dimensional but still threatening Pokémon.

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Standard
Primeape @ Choice Scarf
Vital Spirit
Adamant (+Atk, -SpA) / Jolly (+Spe, -SpA)
4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
- Close Combat
- U-turn
- Stone Edge
- Ice Punch / Earthquake

Primeape has always claimed his own niche as a revenge killer, and this set has largely remained the same over numerous NU metagames. His 120 Base Power Close Combat is still very strong even without an item boost, but the key to Primeape’s prowess is U-turn: when combined with prediction, the Primeape user is rewarded with offensive momentum. Also helpful is Primeape’s ability Vital Spirit, which grants him immunity to sleep, allowing him to come in on predicted Sleep Powders from Jumpluff and Venomoth, for example. Last but not least, a resistance to Stealth Rock gives Primeape the edge over other unfortunate Scarfers like Magmortar; Primeape can come in multiple times over the course of a match without having to worry so much about residual damage.

Close Combat and U-turn define Primeape’s Scarf set, as he is the only Fighting-type in the game with this combination of moves. The remaining two slots are open to all coverage attacks, and there are plenty of options. Stone Edge is a good coverage move that broadens Primeape's revenge-killing spectrum, especially among Bug- and Flying-types that resist Close Combat, like Venomoth and Charizard. For the last slot, Ice Punch hits Gligar, who can take all of Primeape’s other attacks, very hard; it is also a more reliable option to deal with some Flying-types like Jumpluff without the fear of missing. Other notable options for Primeape include Earthquake, which guarantees the OHKO on Skuntank and is the strongest move against opposing Nidoqueen. Seed Bomb, though not mentioned, can guarantee OHKOes on physically defensive Quagsire, who usually walls Primeape handily, and Relicanth, who can take one Close Combat and deal significant damage even with a resisted Head Smash.

Priority is hard for Primeape to avoid, so the best strategy is to keep Primeape at high health. Fortunately, this job is relatively easy as Primeape resists Stealth Rock, but watch out for Spikes putting a huge dent in Primeape’s health. To help reduce the amount of damage Primeape takes, make sure to send him in only on a weak attack or a set-up move as Primeape is frail; Jumpluff’s Sleep Powder is a prime example.

Adamant has long been the preferred option for Scarf Primeape, as the Choice Scarf bolstered Primeape’s Speed but not his Attack. However, with the recent common threats of Scarf Typhlosion and Dragon Dance Charizard, among others, a Jolly nature is definitely under consideration. With a Jolly nature, Primeape outspeeds all neutral natured Scarfed base 100s and 105s like Typhlosion and Manectric, but is still always outpaced by Scarfed base 110s such as Espeon. Consider, also, that without an Adamant nature Primeape cannot OHKO an opposing Typhlosion with Close Combat even with Stealth Rock; it requires the use of Stone Edge or Earthquake. Furthermore, Espeon, who is usually KOed after Stealth Rock with U-turn from an Adamant Primeape, always survives the hit from a Jolly Primeape.

While not entirely necessary hazards are nice; Primeape’s goal is not only to scout the opposing team, but also to act as a revenge killer. However, the free switch-ins granted by U-turn can be exploited by a friendly Qwilfish or Stealth Rocker like Gligar, who himself can U-turn to scout out teams. Primeape is largely self-sufficient, being able to fit in almost every team for his revenging roles, but choose Pokémon that can deal with his most common switch-ins, Psychic-types like Gardevoir and bulky Ground-types like Sandslash, Nidoqueen, and Gligar. Psychic-types are usually trapped by Skuntank; his access to Sucker Punch is also helpful at revenging threats with priority, which Primeape lacks. Most Ground-types are dealt with by bulky waters such as Politoed and Walrein; a teammate Gardevoir can burn all of these Ground-types and her Psychic hits Nidoqueen hard. Exeggutor in particular can deal with both Ground- and Psychic-types, and his Leaf Storm dents numerous Pokémon. Set-up sweepers or just powerful wallbreakers that enjoy favorable match-ups make good teammates as well; Bulk Up Floatzel or a mixed Sharpedo can deal with the aforementioned threats to Primeape.

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Choice Band
Primeape @ Choice Band
Vital Spirit
Jolly (+Spe, -SpA)
4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
- Close Combat
- U-turn
- Stone Edge
- Ice Punch / Earthquake

Though rare, Choice Band is an excellent option which gives Primeape the opportunity to bludgeon its way through supposed "counters" at the expense of revenging. Because Primeape no longer has the utility of revenging fast threats, this Primeape plays with the intention of bluffing a Choice Scarf and eventually muscling his way through his previous counters, such as Sandslash and Quagsire. In comparison to other powerful Choice Banders such as Dodrio, Primeape's U-turn gives him an edge in putting pressure on opposing walls and retaining some degree of his scouting capability. Moreover, Primeape is better at a hit-and-run role with U-turn due to his Stealth Rock resistance, and he retains Vital Spirit to come in on a sleep move from Jumpluff or Venomoth, for example.

The moveset is essentially the same as the Scarf set; Primeape has traded his Speed for extra power in his attacks. Close Combat is the 120 Base Power move that nearly rivals Choice Band Dodrio’s Brave Bird, and Close Combat does not have the nasty side effect of recoil. U-turn helps Primeape scout out his counters, especially since later on in the match he wants to lure them into a powerful Choice Band boosted attack. Stone Edge still hits Flying-types, Ice Punch is useful for Gligar, and Earthquake is strong against Nidoqueen and Skuntank. Seed Bomb is now not a viable option because generally Quagsire and Relicanth will find it hard-pressed to deal with a Banded Close Combat. A Jolly nature is used to get the jump on base 90s like Venomoth and speed tie with other base 95s, such as Haunter.

Because Primeape often attracts bulky, physically defensive Pokémon, especially after Primeape’s Choice Band bluff has been revealed, take advantage with hard-hitting Pokémon. Magmortar and Sharpedo wreck most defensive cores with their wide coverage and powerful attacking stats. As Ground-types are common switch-ins to Primeape, Grass-types like Meganium or Vileplume can use the opportunity to set up dual screens or support the team with Aromatherapy. Entry hazards are still useful, and while Qwilfish has largely monopolized that role, Roselia may be an option to come in on Pokémon like Quagsire. Opposing Gligar switch-ins generally cannot touch Flying-types, so packing a Charizard or a Dodrio may prove very helpful.

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Team Options

As Primeape will often be weaving in and out of the opposition with constant switching out and U-turn, pair Primeape with fast and threatening Pokémon who appreciate free switches. For example, Magmortar, Sharpedo, and Medicham are all very terrifying Pokémon when given an opportunity to attack. This is accentuated when facing against walls; oftentimes Primeape’s replacement switch-in may get more than one turn to attack. Due to this, set-up sweepers are another option; Nasty Plot Ninetales or Bulk Up Floatzel are both fast and powerful after set-up. Entry hazards are also useful for Primeape, like most any other Pokémon, and the opportunities Primeape gives allows Spikers such as Qwilfish to set up freely on opposing Walrein, for instance.

Primeape is powerful with proper support and can be a serious threat if his counters are removed. As Ghost- and Psychic-types can switch into most moves (not U-turn though), pairing Primeape with a trapper Skuntank is a nice insurance that the opposition does not have any chance to escape. Ground-types like Nidoqueen and Sandslash, take little from even Primeape’s super effective attacks, so their removal is necessary. Gardevoir is quite a solid partner to defeat Nidoqueen; not only can she Psychic or Will-O-Wisp Nidoqueen, but with her Trace ability, she gains Poison Point to absorb Toxic Spikes upon entry. Sandslash is helpless against Grass-types, so Meganium is a worthwhile choice; she can heal the status inflictions that plague Primeape so much, especially paralysis and burn.

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Optional Changes

Primeape's effective movepool is shallow, but there are some other notable moves, most of them attack moves as Primeape is usually confined to holding a Choice Band or Choice Scarf. Seed Bomb is a good choice to OHKO Quagsire and Relicanth, both of whom may wall Primeape effectively. Punishment hits Ghost-types super effectively and does major damage to opposing Pokémon that have set up, but the move is largely situational and does not deal much damage to Ghost-types anyways. Taunt is usable on extremely scarce non-Choiced lead Primeape, although there are much more efficient Taunters, such as Persian. Finally, Encore is a method of annoying opposing defensive Pokémon; given the relative scarcity of Encore users, non-Choiced Primeape may find a niche.

In addition to moves, Primeape has other gimmicky sets available. As a lead, the Counter + Reversal strategy is usable, although without a Scarf, Primeape is outpaced by quite a lot more Pokémon. If one really wants to give up the utility of Vital Spirit, Anger Point can be used; Substitute can be used repeatedly in the hope of triggering Anger Point and sweeping with a Salac boost, but this is a risky gimmick which rarely works as well in practice as it does on paper.

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Counters

As Primeape is almost always holding a Choice item, prediction is extremely useful in limiting Primeape's efficiency. One thing to note, however, is that U-turn can easily give the opposing team the upper hand, so be careful when switching into Primeape. Primeape has a few hard counters, though. Dusclops is a surefire counter to Primeape; physical attacks barely dent Dusclops's defenses, while the Ghost-type can retaliate with Seismic Toss or a crippling Will-O-Wisp. Nidoqueen resists Close Combat, U-turn, and Stone Edge; Scarf Earthquakes or Ice Punch cannot 2HKO Nidoqueen regardless. Gardevoir can come in on nearly any move, handily surviving U-turn, and proceed to either OHKO with Psychic or cripple Primeape with Will-O-Wisp. Poison-types like Muk can survive any attack except uncommon Earthquakes and set up.

Depending on which move they come in on, numerous other Pokémon make solid checks to Primeape. Other Ghost-types such as Drifblim and Haunter laugh at Close Combats and start setting up. Several of the other defensive Psychic-types, including Hypno, Grumpig, and the rare Xatu can come in on any non-super effective and OHKO with Psychic or spread status with Thunder Wave. Gligar resists Close Combat and U-turn and can take a few Stone Edges; he only must watch out for Ice Punch. Skuntank, with minor defensive investment, can survive Primeape’s Close Combat; the combination of Sucker Punch, Close Combat’s Defense drops, and Aftermath will badly weaken, if not KO, Primeape.

Ice-eyes - July 31, 2010 11:33 AM (GMT)
I think the Choice Band set should be listed actually. It has an edge over other fast and powerful Banders like Dodrio because of its access to U-Turn, and you might even be able to bluff a Choice Scarf with it. The extra power also lets you bludgeon your way through the likes of Sandslash and Quagsire.

List Nidoqueen as a counter - it's probably the best as nothing on the Scarf set can 2HKO and even if Primeape Ice Punches or EQs on the switch, it's easy to get Rocks up if they're not and then bring in something incredibly dangerous like Sharpedo/Entei/Dodrio.

shrang - July 31, 2010 02:34 PM (GMT)
CB set should also have LO slashed onto it, if you plan on writing it.

Ice-eyes - July 31, 2010 02:49 PM (GMT)
I disagree. If you picked the wrong attack, your coverage moves are unlikely to do enough damage to KO, and then you end up dead or forced out anyway. The power boost is vital, too.

Master12345 - August 20, 2010 06:43 PM (GMT)
I will probably be adding a Choice Band set, thank you. And I completely forgot about Nidoqueen - she is definitely a hard counter to Primeape. :blink:

EDIT: I have made changes given by Ice-eyes via message. Could Ice-eyes confirm this or suggest any other changes?

xdevo14 - August 29, 2010 11:36 PM (GMT)
I think Encore should get a mention in OC (or a full blown annoyer set if you're up yo it).
I've used it in a set like
Primape @ Fist Plate/ Leftovers
~Encore
~ U-turn
~Tuant/ Toxic
~ Close Combat

This really screwed up stall and messes with any bulky cores. And. now that Espeon and Entei are gone and Slowking and Regirock are falling down, stall should make a massive rebound. This set deserves at least OC.

Master12345 - August 30, 2010 02:44 AM (GMT)
Thanks xdevo. I forgot Primeape learned Encore as I must've been so focused on attack moves for Choiced sets.

Now if Ice-eyes can confirm/suggest anything here.

Leman - September 1, 2010 01:38 AM (GMT)
A couple things. First Seed Bomb is weaker than Close Combat on Relicanth. Second for the CB I think you need to put more emphasis on Primeape's new found susceptibility to revenge killing. Encore and Taunt could make a cool lead. The biggest thing it has is Vital Spirit so you beat Jumpluff and Venomoth. The biggest problem I see is that it fares rather poorly agganst Persian and needs all of its strong coverage moves to KO foes like Venomoth, Gligar and Nidoqueen. Primeape might just end up Encoring/Taunting something and U-turning out. You should probably test it. D: OC at least though. And the last bit of OC sounds funny.

Pink Panzer - January 14, 2011 04:31 AM (GMT)
Aren't the Choice Band and Choice Scarf sets the exact same thing? :huh: The only difference(other than the item) is the nature. They should be merged. I'm just sayin'...




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